Toxic fandom has been a perennial problem in SF fandom for _decades_.
Harlan Ellison (yes, I know) delivered a speech at the World Fantasy Convention in *1984* detailing the terrible behavior of a certain subset of fandom.
(And yes, I know that Harlan Ellison had his own terrible behavior problems.)
As always this is very good work. I have a slightly different model of fandom (reductive definition: market-driven, consumption-driven, externally-created identity and community) and reading this, for whatever reason, made something click. I don't really believe in a distinction between healthy and toxic fandom; I think it is like alcohol in that it is poison. Some people have a normal time with it and some people can't. It's a paradigm designed to find and utilize addicts. Thus fandom is a dynamic that is exhibited on a spectrum, making "toxicity" more fluid.
Not saying this to contradict anything here, as even with a slightly different model of critique, I think this post was, as always, correct and well done. Thanks for writing it, Mona and Kat!
I think your model of fandom is very consistent with what we're seeing these days and what is being intentionally perpetuated/encouraged: it's greasing the machine, if not operating as a cog in it. Even our online infrastructure funnels people into these dynamics (fandom greenhouses, as I like to call them). I've noticed non-entertainment brands intentionally fostering this type of affect as well, which means it spreads with the intent to be profit driven and creates corporate cheerleaders.
I would say I think fandom dynamics are part of the human experience. Steven Hassan has a cult model that differentiates between non-destructive cults and destructive cults, so maybe it's more accurate to say it's possible to have non-destructive fandom rather than healthy fandom?
I could just be romanticizing my past, but I do think there are non-market driven acts of fandom, they are just vanishing at this point. I would point to something like the OTW as an example of what this can look like in practice. Ironically, mainstream fandom is very intent on the destruction of their work, which indicates the near impossibility of sustaining these communities in this climate. (At some point I'll write about the attempt to dismantle them, but it's also depressing as fuck which makes it hard to cover.)
Nov 1·edited Nov 1Liked by Katherine Dee, Monia Ali
Well here's the thing; I think fandom as it is today is not part of human dynamics, but is the market supplanting something that is: enthusiasm/enjoyment/community (forgive the nebulosity, this is a hard to articulate idea minus the term "fandom" and that's why it works). I think there would be a thing that looks a lot like fandom if fandom wasn't there, but I think we are being given consumer/market medicine for an ill that is only caused by using the medicine to deprive us of the non-market thing.
Also, I apologize for whatever that last sentence is grammatically speaking lol
Also, also, I think "non-destructive fandom" might be a very good term (although I don't love Hassan for unrelated reasons, not that it invalidates a word said because it doesn't).
i'm sorry i dropped the ball on our collab (happy to pick it back up now that i'm in the groove of life) but you should be the next guest column on this!!
I mostly agree with you, tbh — I would be curious to hear Monia’s thoughts. I do think content creators create a dynamic where we’re all media owners with a stake in our IP and thus fandom can creep into unexpected places
That's definitely part of my internet pessimism--the way the infrastructure has trapped us and fosters these dynamics because it's what's best for the individual creator/the corporate entities that profit off of this type of engagement.
It seems odd to discuss this phenomenon without acknowledging that it is essentially limited to women (and the occasional gay man). I mean, East Coast vs West Coast hip-hop came to outright murder and guys still didn't act like this. It's also hard to imagine that guys would *care* if they found themselves targeted like this. Are women even really adults?
Toxic fandom has been a perennial problem in SF fandom for _decades_.
Harlan Ellison (yes, I know) delivered a speech at the World Fantasy Convention in *1984* detailing the terrible behavior of a certain subset of fandom.
(And yes, I know that Harlan Ellison had his own terrible behavior problems.)
I feel like a good deep dive into the SF fandom would yield something that looks like scrying...
As always this is very good work. I have a slightly different model of fandom (reductive definition: market-driven, consumption-driven, externally-created identity and community) and reading this, for whatever reason, made something click. I don't really believe in a distinction between healthy and toxic fandom; I think it is like alcohol in that it is poison. Some people have a normal time with it and some people can't. It's a paradigm designed to find and utilize addicts. Thus fandom is a dynamic that is exhibited on a spectrum, making "toxicity" more fluid.
Not saying this to contradict anything here, as even with a slightly different model of critique, I think this post was, as always, correct and well done. Thanks for writing it, Mona and Kat!
I think your model of fandom is very consistent with what we're seeing these days and what is being intentionally perpetuated/encouraged: it's greasing the machine, if not operating as a cog in it. Even our online infrastructure funnels people into these dynamics (fandom greenhouses, as I like to call them). I've noticed non-entertainment brands intentionally fostering this type of affect as well, which means it spreads with the intent to be profit driven and creates corporate cheerleaders.
I would say I think fandom dynamics are part of the human experience. Steven Hassan has a cult model that differentiates between non-destructive cults and destructive cults, so maybe it's more accurate to say it's possible to have non-destructive fandom rather than healthy fandom?
I could just be romanticizing my past, but I do think there are non-market driven acts of fandom, they are just vanishing at this point. I would point to something like the OTW as an example of what this can look like in practice. Ironically, mainstream fandom is very intent on the destruction of their work, which indicates the near impossibility of sustaining these communities in this climate. (At some point I'll write about the attempt to dismantle them, but it's also depressing as fuck which makes it hard to cover.)
Well here's the thing; I think fandom as it is today is not part of human dynamics, but is the market supplanting something that is: enthusiasm/enjoyment/community (forgive the nebulosity, this is a hard to articulate idea minus the term "fandom" and that's why it works). I think there would be a thing that looks a lot like fandom if fandom wasn't there, but I think we are being given consumer/market medicine for an ill that is only caused by using the medicine to deprive us of the non-market thing.
Also, I apologize for whatever that last sentence is grammatically speaking lol
Also, also, I think "non-destructive fandom" might be a very good term (although I don't love Hassan for unrelated reasons, not that it invalidates a word said because it doesn't).
yooo completely agree
i'm sorry i dropped the ball on our collab (happy to pick it back up now that i'm in the groove of life) but you should be the next guest column on this!!
if you were down to review mel stanfill's latest book.. that might be very cool
That actually sounds good, I'll read it!
That's fair! I think that critical approach is certainly needed to make sense of our current cultural (and social?) climate.
I mostly agree with you, tbh — I would be curious to hear Monia’s thoughts. I do think content creators create a dynamic where we’re all media owners with a stake in our IP and thus fandom can creep into unexpected places
That's definitely part of my internet pessimism--the way the infrastructure has trapped us and fosters these dynamics because it's what's best for the individual creator/the corporate entities that profit off of this type of engagement.
It seems odd to discuss this phenomenon without acknowledging that it is essentially limited to women (and the occasional gay man). I mean, East Coast vs West Coast hip-hop came to outright murder and guys still didn't act like this. It's also hard to imagine that guys would *care* if they found themselves targeted like this. Are women even really adults?
Fandom is cross-gender. Look at the way the dissident right behaves at its worst on Twitter, those are fandom dynamics